So since Dom 3 is being discussed

Red_Rob · Post by **Red_Rob** » Fri Oct 08, 2010 9:05 pm

Ethereal is nice early on when noone has magic weapons (20% hit chance i think?). Weapon-wise Brands are a steal at 5 gems (I think they're level 4 though).

Protection doesn't help much because multiple attackers get to avoid it. For defence you are better going for ethereal & luck (80% chance to nullify each attack, then 50% of hits avoided) with some regen to stop the odd lucky hit from adding up over the course of the battle.

Reinvig is also pretty vital, I've lost more SuperCombatants to getting fatigued and mobbed than through clever enemy tactics.

name_here · Post by **name_here** » Fri Oct 08, 2010 9:21 pm

You're thinking of defense. Protection holds up fine against multiple attackers until fatigue allows noticeable numbers of critical hits. Also, his defense score is below average to start with, so it might do with a bit of buffing.

Otherwise, that advice is pretty good. Mind, ethereal is only proof against people with non-magic weapons. Numerous nations have a troop choice with magic weapons.

Avoraciopoctules · Post by **Avoraciopoctules** » Fri Oct 08, 2010 9:51 pm

http://dom3.servegame.com/wiki/Robe_of_Shadows

Item-based etherealness comes online at level 4. It looks like it may be wisest to save my gems for the time being.

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I found a site on my second search. Decent, but I could hope for more. Fortunately, next area I search my pretender will be participating in the battle for the province, so I'll at least get a chance at delicious XP even if E4F4 finds nothing.

EDIT: Skimmed the item list again. Actually, I should be able to make luck accessories right now. And most of my gems are astral, so there is plenty of raw material. Should still see if I can get Earth gems to start crafting with a bonus, though.

K · Post by K » Fri Oct 08, 2010 10:19 pm

Avoraciopoctules wrote:60 militia should slow down the indies long enough for my astral evocations to do something. With 2 mages throwing evocations and 12 decent infantry behind the militia and scripted to hold and attack, something decent might result. The scouting report doesn't mention archers, so I should be able to close to melee without the militia routing. Also, I forgot that the mercs were militia.

Tactically, never underestimate the value of chaff (also called arrow catchers).

For example, indies often have cavalry who have lance attacks that cause someone to explode on the first hit.... so the natural tactic is to send off some low value unit to run ahead of your army and explode, absorbing the attack so a high value unit can kill the cav with relative impunity.

I'm using Mictlan right now and Slaves are perfect for this purpose considering that I send off a unit that doesn't cost gold to save units that do cost gold (you get 5 slaves at the cost of some population and a unit's turn).

Later in the game, chaff is used to soak up Evocations and other battle magics, or simply to slow the enemy line so that your ranged attackers like archers or magic can fire indiscriminately into the melee.

Slingers often make good chaff, but most nations have one or two super-cheap options.

Avoraciopoctules · Post by **Avoraciopoctules** » Fri Oct 08, 2010 10:42 pm

And according to the scouting reports, there are approximately 30 enemies, most of which lack ranged attacks. Since I'm Arco, I have some reason to trust this. I probably outnumber the enemies 2 to 1. I am reasonably confident of victory, and the militia can get relegated to general chaff duties once my main army catches up.

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I find it difficult to stomach paying 100 gold for an elephant right now. Are chariots decent in groups of 20 or so? Maybe with morale-14 infantry in the formation to make it harder for the squad to fall apart under arrow fire?

Akula · Post by **Akula** » Fri Oct 08, 2010 11:11 pm

No. Chariots are too fragile to make a reliable expansion force. They get ganged up on and have shit for Prot and HP. 10 Elephants is preferable to 20 chariots in every way. 5 Elephants is preferable to 20 chariots.

Avoraciopoctules · Post by **Avoraciopoctules** » Fri Oct 08, 2010 11:14 pm

Yeah, that 10 HP could be problematic. What role do chariots have, then?

K · Post by K » Fri Oct 08, 2010 11:21 pm

Avoraciopoctules wrote:And according to the scouting reports, there are approximately 30 enemies, most of which lack ranged attacks. Since I'm Arco, I have some reason to trust this. I probably outnumber the enemies 2 to 1. I am reasonably confident of victory, and the militia can get relegated to general chaff duties once my main army catches up.

Quality of troops matters more than quantity. For example, against computer armies I'm used to a 10-1 or better ratio of my losses to kills.

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Avoraciopoctules wrote:I find it difficult to stomach paying 100 gold for an elephant right now. Are chariots decent in groups of 20 or so? Maybe with morale-14 infantry in the formation to make it harder for the squad to fall apart under arrow fire?

Elephants are brutal when massed where chariots tend to die like bitches. As a pro tip, getting a mage to turn them ethereal is a low magic option for drastically increasing their lifespan.

Avoraciopoctules · Post by **Avoraciopoctules** » Fri Oct 08, 2010 11:28 pm

Darn. On the upside, I think I can still afford to cancel the recruitment of the 2 I put into my recruitment queue. Still trying to decide whether I should get elephants or a new fort once my gold accumulates a bit.

name_here · Post by **name_here** » Sat Oct 09, 2010 1:49 am

Chaff are always good, but if their morale is low enough they might rout and take your army with them.

Orca · Post by **Orca** » Sat Oct 09, 2010 2:42 am

Turn sent in.

About Asterios, you might consider an enchanted pike for him. A length 6 weapon is yet another means of not getting hurt, and it's cheap.

In MA T'ien chi, are red guards really shit? I mean, the hit point penalty in off seasons hurts but a nature blessing will get some of those hit points back before you make contact, and they seem to have decent stats otherwise.

Avoraciopoctules · Post by **Avoraciopoctules** » Sat Oct 09, 2010 3:08 am

Orca wrote:Turn sent in.

About Asterios, you might consider an enchanted pike for him. A length 6 weapon is yet another means of not getting hurt, and it's cheap.

That does sound like a pretty interesting idea. And I could make one in the next couple turns.

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With regards to the militia, here's my troop lineup and the province I'm attacking.

Given this information, do you think the militia are a worthwhile addition? Anyone have suggestions for alterations in tactics?

EDIT:

If necessary, I do have more magical dakka. Not sure whether the research hit of using more than 2 mages for evocation is worth it at this point. Only so many people to blast, and I'm hoping the XP boost to research will justify losing these 2 for a short time. Also, note that I got a mage with both randoms (including the 10%) in astral on turn 1. I only realized this now. With a bit of boosting, I could have this dude cast Wish. That is gnarly.

angelfromanotherpin · Post by **angelfromanotherpin** » Sat Oct 09, 2010 4:08 am

I envy your double-digit unit sizes.

Avoraciopoctules · Post by **Avoraciopoctules** » Sat Oct 09, 2010 4:19 am

Yeah, I got all the undisciplined peasants with spears I could ever use. Feels good, man.

Username17 · Post by **Username17** » Sat Oct 09, 2010 5:57 am

Your untrained, undisciplined units have spears? Lucky dog.

We send our soldiers into battle untrained and unarmed.

-Username17

cthulhu · Post by **cthulhu** » Sat Oct 09, 2010 11:15 am

When should you build a second castle?

I know it's like, super important but at the same time it's 1200 gp and that's a SHITLOAD of dudes.

cthulhu · Post by **cthulhu** » Sat Oct 09, 2010 12:01 pm

angelfromanotherpin · Post by **angelfromanotherpin** » Sat Oct 09, 2010 1:30 pm

cthulhu wrote:When should you build a second castle?

I know it's like, super important but at the same time it's 1200 gp and that's a SHITLOAD of dudes.

It really depends on the faction. Some factions want them as soon as practical, others have a more leisurely schedule.

A lot of people try to get their first new fort in a forest or mountain so they get a worse/cheaper fort, usually for 800 and 3 months work instead of 1200 and 5 months.

cthulhu · Post by **cthulhu** » Sat Oct 09, 2010 2:02 pm

Hey, I noticed from the score graph the vanhiem player isn't doing anything.. shouldn't he be set to AI?

K · Post by K » Sat Oct 09, 2010 11:12 pm

FrankTrollman wrote:Your untrained, undisciplined units have spears? Lucky dog.

We send our soldiers into battle untrained and unarmed.

-Username17

Spears? Pangaea doesn't even have pants technology.

Korwin · Post by **Korwin** » Sat Oct 09, 2010 11:31 pm

cthulhu wrote:Hey, I noticed from the score graph the vanhiem player isn't doing anything.. shouldn't he be set to AI?

I could take over, if the orginal player has an case of RL interrupting his play time.

Edit:
I would need the Pretender file and PW?

name_here · Post by **name_here** » Sat Oct 09, 2010 11:44 pm

The problem is a CD key glitch. I guess you taking over would be fine.

cthulhu · Post by **cthulhu** » Sun Oct 10, 2010 12:12 am

Just the PW, the pretender is 'baked in' to the files.

cthulhu · Post by **cthulhu** » Sun Oct 10, 2010 1:47 am

Edit: I'll edit this out when I am done.

Orion · Post by **Orion** » Sun Oct 10, 2010 1:50 am

So I've finally won a game against normal AIs (never lost one, but gotten bogged down and lost interest). I was playing Kailasa, and won via massed blessed sacreds right around the time my late-game shenanigans were starting to come online. Clearly I need more challenging opponents. Questions:

What is the highest difficulty of AI it is reasonable to play against before going to MP? Does the AI "cheat" at some point?

Rapid expansion tends to lead me to a war on two fronts almost immediately. In MP games I assume diplomacy takes care of this, or is it considered best to keep a layer of indeps between yourself an enemies. I often don't get around to conquering indepedent knights because my policy of "attack tribals and militias first" siphon all my gold to province defense and border wars.

Related: Sieging capitals takes an unreasonably long time, and I can't build province defense while I'm sitting there. In the meantime I'm vulnerable to other players and to his own armies from elsewhere. What should I be doing to KO faster and how do I stay safe doing it?